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EdTechWeekly#198 - 'New Format' & Constuctivism in Education

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  • Length: 70:24 minutes (32.23 MB)
  • Format: MP3 Mono 44kHz 64Kbps (CBR)
EdTechWeekly #198
September 11, 2011

Participants:   Jennifer MaddrellJeff Lebowdave cormierJohn SchinkerAnne Marie Cunningham 

Featured Topic:   Constructivism - Is it an evil lie? Does it work as a Learning Model? Does it presribe a Teaching Model? How is Jen going to finish her dissertation?

Other Stuff:  Figuring out our 'new' show format, Change MOOC & COOLCast starting up

Next Week's Topic: Google+ in Education
To share feedback or suggestions for future shows, please comment below.

Chat Log Below

  • Paul: I can just type, tight?
  • John: Hey...
  • JenM: hello
  • dave: i might
  • JenM: edtechbiweekly
  • JenM: ETBW
  • JenM: go daaave, go daaave
  • gsiemens: dave has a natural audience?
  • gsiemens: life isn't fun anymore, Dave
  • JenM: he doesn't even need an audience, really ... right?
  • gsiemens: you use many words dave
  • JenM: or a lot of the same words many different ways ...
  • courosa: video-y
  • JenM: @coursa ... now all we need is a format and something to say :)
  • courosa: so is this like random video switching? is it controlled by who's talking?
  • gsiemens: dave said pedagogical
  • JL: That's the G+ way
  • JenM: well ... it will probably be mainly dave's face ... he he he
  • courosa: this week in stuff
  • dave: i'll do more face
  • gsiemens: mooc-cast was great
  • courosa: i said mooc in shanghai - international audience sees that word as so much different
  • gsiemens: mooc means "mucus" in spanish, apparently
  • courosa: i want to see dave eat a donair on one of the cuts
  • gsiemens: @courosa - what do they see it as?
  • gsiemens: i.e. mooc
  • courosa: @gsiemens i heard something about an italian slur, and forget what the other one was - it was an international crowd, @gravesle brought it up.
  • courosa: @gsiemens and the coffee - bleech
  • gsiemens: :)
  • gsiemens: Chinese coffee not so good?
  • courosa: not once had a good experience with coffee
  • gsiemens: I'll bring some instant coffee
  • gsiemens: or something
  • courosa: @gsiemens that would be a much better alternative
  • gsiemens: how long are you home for Alec?
  • courosa: this week in cool
  • JenM: twic ... hmmm
  • courosa: i'm in Denver right now - headed back in a few hours. Have a few Canadian trips over next 1.5 months, then 2 weeks in Oz. Home most of the time until then, though.
  • gsiemens: adobe connect is ***
  • gsiemens: wow, it censored my post
  • courosa: does livestream still have the video ads? i didn't see one.
  • gsiemens: I typed ***
  • courosa: ***
  • gsiemens: and it produced ***
  • gsiemens: ***
  • gsiemens: crazy
  • JenM: *** ...
  • courosa: ustream does that as well - but you can turn it off
  • gsiemens: quite your cussin' @alec, Jen
  • courosa: *** *** ***
  • gsiemens: Do you guys do relationship advice?
  • John: of course. Are you willing to take it from us?
  • courosa: it didn't censore 'mooc' so it must be OK
  • gsiemens: or maybe you could do "this week in global conflict"
  • gsiemens: *** mooc
  • courosa: this week in censorship
  • gsiemens: that's where I need help
  • courosa: this week in ***
  • gsiemens: The Dave Cormier 12-step program
  • gsiemens: I want more professionalism for my $$
  • gsiemens: @dave, do something about your *** up epistemology
  • gsiemens: anything that requires talking, not doing, is good with dave
  • courosa: *** no
  • gsiemens: Let's hear Jen's views
  • gsiemens: what does she think about constructivism?
  • gsiemens: what is your learning orientation?
  • courosa: has it ever really been alive? constructivism is sort of like marxism - good on paper.
  • gsiemens: @courosa - ooh. good quote
  • gsiemens: or statement
  • courosa: in years of observing classrooms, i've yet to see convincing examples of 'true' constructivism
  • gsiemens: Dave is gone. God is helping to protect us
  • gsiemens: ***
  • gsiemens: @courosa - how would you define your teaching model/learning theory in ec&i831
  • gsiemens: is COI constructivist?
  • courosa: eci831 - not sure, but certainly not constructivism - still much too led content-wise as well as network formation.
  • courosa: depends - radical constructivism would not have those features
  • gsiemens: @dave - von glaserfeld would argue with you
  • courosa: what @gsiemens said
  • matt montagne: hey all
  • amcunningham: hi- just joining in as interesting topic:)
  • amcunningham: recently came across some papers following Bernsetin by Wheelahan on the 'problems' of constructivism eg http://scholar.googleusercontent.com/scholar?q=cache:BoPyQRMRf9MJ:schola...
  • courosa: oooh ... when do you defend JenM?
  • JL: welcome amcunningham
  • amcunningham: bad link http://www.ingentaconnect.com/content/routledg/cjew/2009/00000022/000000...
  • JenM: @alec ... within a couple months (with hope) :)
  • courosa: awesome! looking forward to hear the news of your success.
  • JenM: me, too :)
  • jilliannecode: Hello everyone
  • JenM: hello!
  • jilliannecode: :)
  • courosa: one of the most common critiques of constructivism has been lack of practice/repetition in terms of new skills/knowledge taking hold. construction of an idea is not as 'sticky' as it is mad to sound
  • courosa: hey jillian
  • dave: i've built lots of stuff i couldn't build again a week later
  • matt montagne: would you say montessori models are constuctivist??
  • matt montagne: Or the free school models? Are they?
  • dave: brainwashing vs. survivalism?
  • jilliannecode: Hi Alec :)
  • amcunningham: sounds constructivist to me....
  • jilliannecode: :)
  • matt montagne: The montessoi model is compelling...flush the premises with resources and interesting materaials and get out of the way
  • jilliannecode: It was fun!
  • jilliannecode: yep that's me
  • courosa: that's her - i eavesdropped from shanghai
  • jilliannecode: LOL
  • matt montagne: constructivsm wouldn't give you US History in 4th, 8th, and 11 grades like in the USA
  • matt montagne: sometimes it's best to define something by what it isn't...so what isn't constructivism?
  • jilliannecode: Psychomotor skills are different than cognitive skills.
  • JenM: @matt ... good point ...
  • courosa: mmmm ... i could use a buffet
  • jilliannecode: Constructivism may not work in the aquisition of psychomotor skills... or would it?
  • jilliannecode: Psychomotor --> "hard skills" i.e. military training
  • dave: @jilliancode how do you learn to parralell park?
  • dave: psychomotor?
  • jilliannecode: yep
  • jilliannecode: "hard skill"
  • jilliannecode: Hi Dave :)
  • amcunningham: have you seen this? Learning and Teaching Languages Online: A Constructivist Approach http://www.ingilish.com/online-learning-constructivism.htm
  • dave: is it a constructivist or an objectivist process?
  • dave: hi Jilianne :)
  • jilliannecode: I am haunting you
  • courosa: i'm out - gotta find some grub before my flight. looking fwd to the new format.
  • jilliannecode: See ya Alec
  • matt montagne: I don't know, Jilian. You could teach woodshop construction via an instructivist/training model, or it could also be taught in a constructivist manner.
  • John: Dave is used to stalkers.
  • dave: @matt good example
  • John: Learn to parallel park by practicing (with someone else's car)
  • amcunningham: mmm= yes, can leave learners feeling powerless...
  • matt montagne: constructivsm isn't void of practice and repitition
  • amcunningham: oh- I meant can leave TEACHERS feeling poweless!
  • matt montagne: I think the difference is that the learner gets to choose what they wan't to practice and repeat, WHEN they need it.
  • dave: ah. that makes more sense
  • amcunningham: i like the way wenger talks about 'plug and play' theories.... different approaches needed for different outcomes
  • jilliannecode: Great example @matt. Also - shouldn't we choose the instructional approach / theory to suit whichever outcome is required?
  • jilliannecode: @amcunningham - exactly
  • jilliannecode: "higher end" institution? which one am I at? ;)
  • matt montagne: it is elistist Dave. The 'free schools,' which are built on constructivist underpinnings, seem to be inhabited by the wealthy. Poor kids tend to get instruvist schools and approacahes
  • matt montagne: The system seems to rail against the constructivist approach-many feel as though it devalues the role of the adult/teacher in the room
  • amcunningham: we talk about about constructive approaches in medical education... but manypeople are seriously cyncial about reflection and postfolios... interesting to think about wht
  • amcunningham: @matt yes, very interesting- I know Bernstein not so well liked/understood in US but he says that ts because middle class/richer get off to a head start with the kinds of language they use
  • JenM: @matt ... what would you define as a "constructivist approach"?
  • matt montagne: @Jen - monteossori models, free schools, student direction, etc. The learning isn't directed by content. It's directed by the interests of the user/learner
  • amcunningham: plus??
  • John: Google Plus
  • amcunningham: oh-
  • matt montagne: that said, I am very humble about it, Jen. I don't have any good answers-but I also know that the dominatnt, instructivist approach is broken.
  • @leonardlow: Hey, how's it going, what's going on? :)  (Saw your tweet, came on over) :)
  • JenM: @matt ... yes ... for the reason(s) John mentioned
  • JL: all are welcome to join: let know your gmail. Hangout at: https://talkgadget.google.com/hangouts/07b6b25e65c62aeb9659eb0c0511b6af7...
  • matt montagne: many models built on constructivist models have crashed and burned. Open Education schools of the 60s come to mind. And the non-graded/continuous progress models didn't last either
  • JenM: @matt ... what about an "instructivist" who uses "constructivist" approaches (i.e. constructivst approach for specific objectives) ... Is that possible?
  • @leonardlow: Gotta run to a meeting. Constructivism isn't dead.  It's a LEARNING model and helps to explain the process of learning.  It does NOT prescribe a TEACHING model.
  • JenM: @leon ... nice distinction learning theory vs instructional practice
  • matt montagne: @Jen - I think in practice there very much is a blend, but the dominant approach is still instructivist.
  • matt montagne: My dream is that the dominant form would be PBL/constructivism, with instructivist approaches being used minimally.
  • matt montagne: work places are chaning thought...many work places no longer want rule followers. They want people who know how to deal with ambiguity. They want people who can attack perplexity in novel ways.
  • matt montagne: @JenM - for your research have you looked at constructivism in non-obvous sectors? eg, I'm thinking of summer camp, the work place, athletics, etc.
  • jilliannecode: The system has 'killed' the creativity and problem solving skills that children have naturally. A la Ken Robinson.
  • jilliannecode: where is the schedule of talks?
  • matt montagne: good luck with your research and thanks for sharing, Jen!!!
  • JenM: @matt ... get you headset ready for next time ...
  • JenM: *your
  • amcunningham: many thanks- good night:)
  • matt montagne: baby duty tonight, so for sure in the future, Jen!!!
  • jilliannecode: So is this about social networks in the classroom or about Google+?
  • matt montagne: I like the new direction...should be fun.
  • jilliannecode: ciao
  • JL: Thanks all - Have a great week and ?? ? ? ? ??