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Parents as Partner Episode # 29 October 19, 2009

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  • Length: 57:44 minutes (26.43 MB)
  • Format: MP3 Mono 22kHz 64Kbps (CBR)

Parents as Partners hosts Lorna Costantini, Cindy Seibel and Matt Montagne welcomed Jacqui Strachan, Gay Stephenson from People for Education, Tanya Weiner, webmaster for Ottawa Carleton Assembly of School Councils and Ross Button from Upper Canada District School Board as they talk about how they communicate with parents. We had a difficult time with connections and audio. Ross, Tanya, Gay, and Jacqui shared some excellent ideas about how to moderate parent online communities as well as increase participation.

The recording has been edited to remove some of the transmission problems. Please be patient there was some very good conversations.

 

 

Chat Log

 

18:24:13 neternity -> -EdTechTalk: just dropped in early for a 9pm webcast to make sure it all works for me
20:54:39 PeggyG -> -EdTechTalk: what does that error message mean?
20:54:52 Lorna -> -EdTechTalk: don't know
20:55:57 neternity -> -EdTechTalk: I am here and so are three others - we have a group
20:56:32 neternity -> -EdTechTalk: Murmel murmel murmel says the skype call
20:56:45 PeggyG -> -EdTechTalk: looks like we can just ignore that error message because we are obviously in the room :-)
20:56:55 matt montagne -> -EdTechTalk: hey all
20:57:17 PeggyG -> -EdTechTalk: hi everyone! another great show with Parents as Partners!! looking forward to it!
20:57:23 PeggyG -> -EdTechTalk: Hi Matt
20:57:47 PeggyG -> -EdTechTalk: @Matt-the gifted conference you attended sounded fantastic! just finished reading your blog post
21:00:49 avenneri -> -EdTechTalk: Is there something that we are listening to or watching here tonight?
21:01:07 PeggyG -> -EdTechTalk: didn't realize you were streaming on ustream--I was listening on itunes
21:01:38 PeggyG -> -EdTechTalk: @avenneri-click on play on the ustream window
21:02:03 PeggyG -> -EdTechTalk: hearing you fine Matt
21:02:37 PeggyG -> -EdTechTalk: it sounded great and you got to hear John Seely Brown :-)
21:03:08 PeggyG -> -EdTechTalk: I heard him interviewed with Steve Hargadon too :-)
21:03:23 PeggyG -> -EdTechTalk: interesting observation about the webcast!
21:03:47 PeggyG -> -EdTechTalk: wonder if it has to do with focus?
21:04:20 PeggyG -> -EdTechTalk: ETT-A is up now
21:05:02 PeggyG -> -EdTechTalk: ok sounds good-everyone click on ETT-A
21:05:38 PeggyG -> -EdTechTalk: the joys of technology :-)
21:06:12 PeggyG -> -EdTechTalk: hearing you fine on ETT-A
21:07:16 PeggyG -> -EdTechTalk: oops-just lost the audio
21:07:24 avenneri -> -EdTechTalk: how do i hear this?
21:07:25 Tanya -> -EdTechTalk: I lost you
21:07:31 bsnow_parent -> -EdTechTalk: had me worried for a minute
21:07:37 Tanya -> -EdTechTalk: okay we're back :)
21:07:39 PeggyG -> -EdTechTalk: hearing you again now
21:07:55 PeggyG -> -EdTechTalk: this is always fun!!
21:07:58 Jeannine St. Amand -> -EdTechTalk: lol 
21:08:17 avenneri -> -EdTechTalk: Can anyone help?
21:08:46 PeggyG -> -EdTechTalk: @avenneri-try clicking on one of the icons under EdTechTalk A
21:09:24 matt montagne -> -EdTechTalk: hey there ross
21:10:23 avenneri -> -EdTechTalk: Is this on ? I cant hear anything
21:10:58 matt montagne -> -EdTechTalk: avenneri
21:10:59 ross -> -EdTechTalk: it is on, there is sound that i am able to hear
21:11:15 matt montagne -> -EdTechTalk: click Edtech Talk A in upper right hand corner...click the little speaker icon
21:11:23 matt montagne -> -EdTechTalk: hey Jeannine
21:11:56 PeggyG -> -EdTechTalk: I'm listening on itunes which is what comes up for I click on the first icon
21:12:03 Jeannine St. Amand -> -EdTechTalk: Hi Matt! Hi Lorna! Hi Cindy! Hi Peggy!
21:12:13 PeggyG -> -EdTechTalk: Hi Jeannine!
21:13:44 PeggyG -> -EdTechTalk: ning
21:14:10 Tanya -> -EdTechTalk: That was an interesting conversation
21:14:20 avenneri -> -EdTechTalk: Thanks Matt ! I can hear it now.
21:14:35 PeggyG -> -EdTechTalk: I know people are sometimes uncomfortable using their real names online but I think it's really important!
21:14:48 matt montagne -> -EdTechTalk: cool, glad you got the audio avenneri...a rocky nite with the Internet here
21:14:56 Tanya -> -EdTechTalk: lost you Jacqui
21:15:12 matt montagne -> -EdTechTalk: My thought is that you jump right in and do it...fire, ready, aim
21:15:21 PeggyG -> -EdTechTalk: I agree Matt!
21:15:39 matt montagne -> -EdTechTalk: our library has lead the way at our small little school with a facebook fan page
21:16:46 ross -> -EdTechTalk: it must be a slow night on tv, the internets are busy
21:17:04 PeggyG -> -EdTechTalk: I agree with that Jeannine! you need to think about what you put online
21:17:34 PeggyG -> -EdTechTalk: it was nice that the world series playoff game concluded before our show :-)
21:18:07 Tanya -> -EdTechTalk: Jacqui have you had a great deal of difficulty "policing" the discussions on your Ning?
21:18:25 PeggyG -> -EdTechTalk: it's the anonymous comments I read in the local TV chats that are often inappropriate
21:19:04 ross -> -EdTechTalk: i'd start with the lyrics of some songs on the radio and we can go downhill from there
21:19:23 PeggyG -> -EdTechTalk: do you have written policies for netiquette on your Ning?
21:20:04 PeggyG -> -EdTechTalk: excellent point! sarcasm doesn't come through well in writing
21:20:09 bsnow_parent -> -EdTechTalk: I'm a parent at a school (board?) where we have very little online communication.  How do I get it started?  Even one-way broadcast is met with skepticism.
21:20:13 ross -> -EdTechTalk: p4e does, we haven't gone there yet
21:21:08 Sarah H -> -EdTechTalk: @bsnow--I'm not sure I can help, but I'm a teacher who is literally begging parents to join our class wiki with mixed success.
21:21:13 Tanya -> -EdTechTalk: OCASC has minimal policies posted for our forums.  There hasn't been a need yet to eexpand the policies.  Everyone so far has been very well behaved online.
21:21:16 PeggyG -> -EdTechTalk: @bsnow-sometimes it helps to start small with just a small group
21:21:39 matt montagne -> -EdTechTalk: that is a good way to say it...we're learnign as we go along
21:22:52 PeggyG -> -EdTechTalk: sometimes even with fairly tech savvy educators they are reluctant to add things to a wikispace--sandboxes help to give them confidence :-)
21:22:58 cgseibel -> -EdTechTalk: Yesterday I saw an update of AUP policies - I'll try to find it.
21:24:10 PeggyG -> -EdTechTalk: http://peopleforeducation.com/
21:24:35 cgseibel -> -EdTechTalk: Gay sounds like she's describing the same issue Penny did last week - keeping volunteers engaged in community
21:24:44 PeggyG -> -EdTechTalk: it takes a lot of nurturing and encouragement to keep people actively involved in online communities
21:25:28 cgseibel -> -EdTechTalk: http://schools-at-the-centre.ning.com
21:25:39 PeggyG -> -EdTechTalk: http://schools-at-the-centre.ning.com/forum/topics/online-discussion-net...
21:25:53 cgseibel -> -EdTechTalk: centre spelt canadian:D 
21:25:56 PeggyG -> -EdTechTalk: http://schools-at-the-centre.ning.com/
21:26:10 monty1 -> -EdTechTalk: does anyone have an email specific for parents/school councils on their school website? Is it done throug the board?
21:26:28 cgseibel -> -EdTechTalk: Penny - I mentioned your name and there you are!
21:26:35 cgseibel -> -EdTechTalk: We're having some sound problems tonight.
21:26:57 cgseibel -> -EdTechTalk: We'll clean them up when the show is edited for posting
21:27:12 bsnow_parent -> -EdTechTalk: Just this year I set up a mailing list for our council.  Not from the board.
21:27:28 PeggyG -> -EdTechTalk: @monty1--do you mean an email listserv for parents?
21:27:53 plind -> -EdTechTalk: just getting my audio set up -- nice to see you too cindy!
21:28:08 plind -> -EdTechTalk: I hope my name was up in a good way ;-)
21:28:40 cgseibel -> -EdTechTalk: @plind - yes gay was commenting on the same issue you raised last week - about the need for volunteers to maintain online community
21:28:55 monty1 -> -EdTechTalk: peggyG - I was thinking of an email for parents to ask questions or give ideas.
21:29:58 plind -> -EdTechTalk: just listened to a pln talk from Sue Waters ,, she also mentioned that in a Ning community, as a moderator you have to ensure that it is being "fed"
21:30:48 bsnow_parent -> -EdTechTalk: Who do you convince and how do you get people over those concerns?
21:31:40 plind -> -EdTechTalk: very important that ppl use their own name -- heads off alot of problems right there
21:32:45 cgseibel -> -EdTechTalk: INteresting discussion when we ask if children should use their own names.
21:33:10 cgseibel -> -EdTechTalk: Pseudonyms protect children's privacy, but does it create a double standard when we say no to adults/parents?
21:34:56 plind -> -EdTechTalk: @cindy -- I think for kids if there are pseudonyms the immediate community (teachers, fellow students) should know who they are
21:35:32 cgseibel -> -EdTechTalk: @plind that's a good idea - then you're protecting the student but not encouraging full-ourt anonymity
21:35:42 cgseibel -> -EdTechTalk: oops - full-out anonymity
21:35:48 PeggyG -> -EdTechTalk: I like that idea plind!
21:35:57 plind -> -EdTechTalk: and a discussion around it is essential (ie function of pseudonyms) nb of transparency
21:36:09 matt montagne -> -EdTechTalk: a lot of people think all of this will just take alot of time...and to a certain extent, they are right
21:36:21 bsnow_parent -> -EdTechTalk: You can get a lot of parents on the mailing list just by advertising that it is the best way to find out about snow days.  
21:36:35 PeggyG -> -EdTechTalk: :-) so true bsnow!
21:36:44 plind -> -EdTechTalk: Lorna -- every parent will engage with their learner in their own way -- again the difference of engaging with you kids vs engaging with the school
21:37:11 PeggyG -> -EdTechTalk: you're really hitting an important point! parents will get involved when you're talking about things they consider relevant to them
21:37:25 plind -> -EdTechTalk: @bsnow -- ideal!  that's value added for a parent -- that's the hook!
21:38:26 matt montagne -> -EdTechTalk: pandemics do the same unfortunately
21:38:40 PeggyG -> -EdTechTalk: excellent example Matt
21:38:59 PeggyG -> -EdTechTalk: pandemics are definitely a "need to know"...
21:39:14 cgseibel -> -EdTechTalk: ross is in the house
21:39:45 PeggyG -> -EdTechTalk: Welcome Ross!
21:39:45 cgseibel -> -EdTechTalk: ross, I know the CIO there
21:40:20 PeggyG -> -EdTechTalk: http://familyofschools.ning.com/
21:41:44 plind -> -EdTechTalk: sounds great Ross
21:42:28 PeggyG -> -EdTechTalk: Nings are such easy-to-navigate sites for people who aren't tech savvy
21:42:58 Tanya -> -EdTechTalk: Blogs are super easy too
21:43:07 PeggyG -> -EdTechTalk: http://carletonplacehighschool.ning.com/
21:43:16 plind -> -EdTechTalk: so key that parents got comfortable using the tech for own purposes first -- then easy to make the leap to use it for other things
21:44:03 plind -> -EdTechTalk: fridge magnets -- great!
21:44:04 PeggyG -> -EdTechTalk: great idea-fridge nagmets :-)
21:44:10 PeggyG -> -EdTechTalk: magnets
21:44:30 cgseibel -> -EdTechTalk: I think this is the site I was looking for:  http://landmark-project.com/aup20/pmwiki.php?n=Main.Notes
21:44:38 avenneri -> -EdTechTalk: what info is on fridge magnets?
21:44:41 PeggyG -> -EdTechTalk: we used to give our parents fridge magnets for the essential school phone numbers including the school homework hotline :-)
21:44:51 plind -> -EdTechTalk: very nb -- regular activity
21:44:53 cgseibel -> -EdTechTalk: Aups for schools in 21st century - looks like David Warlick's site
21:44:58 PeggyG -> -EdTechTalk: we also included the nurse's phone number
21:45:08 Tanya -> -EdTechTalk: we have alot of "lurkers" on the OCASC boards - trying to get them engaged
21:45:46 PeggyG -> -EdTechTalk: yes Cindy-David Warlick's site is a great compilation of many AUPs for web 2.0
21:46:02 cgseibel -> -EdTechTalk: All the online community research suggests that someone needs to be a "moderator" or "energizer"
21:46:05 plind -> -EdTechTalk: someone 2day said not lurking -- "passively engaging"
21:46:19 cgseibel -> -EdTechTalk: @plind - like that language better!
21:46:24 PeggyG -> -EdTechTalk: like that @plind :-)
21:46:50 Tanya -> -EdTechTalk: I like that "passively engaging" :)
21:47:13 PeggyG -> -EdTechTalk: I think lurking is a good way to start--then you build your confidence and reply to someone :-) takes awhile to feel comfortable
21:47:31 cgseibel -> -EdTechTalk: yes Peggy - community building
21:48:09 plind -> -EdTechTalk: lurking is very under-rated -- it's a very important step
21:48:11 cgseibel -> -EdTechTalk: I talked about these various roles in my "Going Down the Rabbit Hole" presentation - guides, mentors, etc
21:48:20 PeggyG -> -EdTechTalk: http://beckwithpublicschool.ning.com/
21:48:47 PeggyG -> -EdTechTalk: what's the link for that presentation Cindy?
21:49:14 plind -> -EdTechTalk: We had an AUP  that people had to agree to when they signed up to our ning
21:49:28 cgseibel -> -EdTechTalk: @peggyg - it's on my slideshare - http://slideshare.net/rdrunner
21:49:37 avenneri -> -EdTechTalk: Are the facebook pages only for CSC members or would it be open to our extended school families?
21:49:49 plind -> -EdTechTalk: just set up what the expectations of how the space was to be used were
21:50:08 PeggyG -> -EdTechTalk: http://barrhavencsc.wordpress.com/  bell time survey on this link
21:50:32 PeggyG -> -EdTechTalk: http://jockvalesc.wordpress.com/
21:50:33 Jeannine St. Amand -> -EdTechTalk: The discussion is good Lorna - no worries!
21:51:18 PeggyG -> -EdTechTalk: http://ocasc.ca/  Ottawa Carleton Assembly of School Councils
21:51:21 Tanya -> -EdTechTalk: I lost the audio feed - is the discussion still running?
21:51:27 PeggyG -> -EdTechTalk: yes Tanya
21:51:48 Tanya -> -EdTechTalk: okay I'm back :)
21:51:59 PeggyG -> -EdTechTalk: great Tanya!!
21:52:16 PeggyG -> -EdTechTalk: that sounds like a great day!!
21:52:30 avenneri -> -EdTechTalk: when and where is that?
21:53:07 PeggyG -> -EdTechTalk: you're a trooper Jacquie!!
21:53:42 PeggyG -> -EdTechTalk: these tech issues are not because of the people!! they are beyond your control!
21:53:44 cgseibel -> -EdTechTalk: So now I'll continue with my comment....
21:53:55 plind -> -EdTechTalk: go cindy!
21:54:23 cgseibel -> -EdTechTalk: I was thinking about how we need to examine the online community literature and apply the learnings to our online parent communities
21:54:40 PeggyG -> -EdTechTalk: this is a great followup conversation to the last show!!
21:54:46 Tanya -> -EdTechTalk: examine it how Cindy?
21:54:47 cgseibel -> -EdTechTalk: if I may will link to a page in my portal guide that speaks to this issue
21:55:04 plind -> -EdTechTalk: @cindy - please do
21:55:15 Tanya -> -EdTechTalk: that would be great Cindy
21:55:21 cgseibel -> -EdTechTalk: It's work from Dr. Richard Schwier at University of Saskatchewan
21:55:29 bsnow_parent -> -EdTechTalk: @Cindy - what
21:55:37 bsnow_parent -> -EdTechTalk: 's your portal guide?
21:55:43 plind -> -EdTechTalk: the hard thing with a Ning is the lack of information "pushing'
21:56:16 plind -> -EdTechTalk: better RSS feeds (and parents that know how to use them) would help
21:56:28 cgseibel -> -EdTechTalk: http://portalguide.tech4learning.ca/node/28
21:56:34 PeggyG -> -EdTechTalk: http://portalguide.tech4learning.ca/
21:56:42 PeggyG -> -EdTechTalk: Cindy beat me!
21:57:22 gay@peopleforeducation.com -> -EdTechTalk: what do you mean about the lack of info "pushing"? Just curious as we are finding the ning a great way for parents to share their knowledge with one another
21:57:23 PeggyG -> -EdTechTalk: RSS feeds are scary to lots of people--but I think they just need to be shown and try it out
21:57:46 plind -> -EdTechTalk: @gay -- just the fact that you have to keep logging back in to see if there is new information
21:57:59 Tanya -> -EdTechTalk: I think alot of people don't really understand what an RSS feed is or why they woul duse it.
21:58:19 PeggyG -> -EdTechTalk: exactly plind!! so great when the information comes to you and you don't have to keep checking back to see if anything is new
21:58:28 gay@peopleforeducation.com -> -EdTechTalk: okay - but on the plus side it's a way of connecting with so many more people
21:58:35 cgseibel -> -EdTechTalk: The page describes the elements of the community that may be considered and how to think about them in online communities
21:58:45 plind -> -EdTechTalk: a possible way to integrate a FB fan page with a Ning -- to keep ppl informed of the 'hot" conversations in the Ning
21:59:00 Tanya -> -EdTechTalk: Yahoo Groups are set up with more of a push concept.  Everything is emailed out during conversations.  But they can be overwhelming
21:59:02 plind -> -EdTechTalk: just to keep the site in peoples minds and "lifestream"
21:59:05 PeggyG -> -EdTechTalk: I like that idea plind!!
21:59:13 gay@peopleforeducation.com -> -EdTechTalk: we keep the conversations going because we go back again and again
21:59:40 gay@peopleforeducation.com -> -EdTechTalk: with Ning you pick the conversations you are interested in
22:00:02 bsnow_parent -> -EdTechTalk: I think multimodal is important. Conversations in one place (ning), updates in another (facebook), etc
22:00:03 PeggyG -> -EdTechTalk: communities are so valuable because it always helps to know you're not the only one with the question or problem
22:00:15 bsnow_parent -> -EdTechTalk: Snow days on facebook!!
22:00:18 gay@peopleforeducation.com -> -EdTechTalk: yes multi modal!
22:00:25 ross -> -EdTechTalk: ning's can email when there are changes and do rss well - i link the p4e ning's rss into my school's ning
22:00:38 PeggyG -> -EdTechTalk: @cseibel-your parent handbook portal is such a valuable tool!! I'm so glad you created it!
22:01:03 cgseibel -> -EdTechTalk: sorry Lorna!!
22:01:19 ross -> -EdTechTalk: i also have a custom google search that uses rss to update the ontario education news on our ning's too\
22:01:25 plind -> -EdTechTalk: @gay/ross -- I set up an RSS to follow our Ning -- but problem is educating other parents how to use those tools -- FB may "meet them where they are"
22:01:31 PeggyG -> -EdTechTalk: http://portalguide.tech4learning.ca/
22:01:38 cgseibel -> -EdTechTalk: thanks Peggy - I hope to continue to update it, and like to hear if people have used it and get their feedback
22:02:09 ross -> -EdTechTalk: you can setup a ning to feed and update facebook
22:02:29 gay@peopleforeducation.com -> -EdTechTalk: i'd like to be able to do that ross!
22:02:33 cgseibel -> -EdTechTalk: MOre resources at http://parent20.wikispaces.com
22:02:33 Tanya -> -EdTechTalk: Our group has a lot of concern using FB.  We're working on overcoming that challenge but I think FB is a great way to reach the many quickly and easily.  Anyone using FB on a wide scale?
22:02:43 bsnow_parent -> -EdTechTalk: Oh wow, that does look good.  I'm still at the TOC, but looks perfect for me!
22:03:12 cgseibel -> -EdTechTalk: @tanya - sometimes some training for parents in how to keep the FB community secure can help
22:03:27 PeggyG -> -EdTechTalk: good point--people can still be connected with the community and not be actively contributing all the time
22:03:33 cgseibel -> -EdTechTalk: @tanya - @plind runs Wired Wednesday training sessions with parents, and there are other examples online
22:03:54 ross -> -EdTechTalk: @gay if i can make it to the p4e conf, we can talk and i can show you how
22:04:06 gay@peopleforeducation.com -> -EdTechTalk: good idea to do training and thanks ross
22:04:26 Tanya -> -EdTechTalk: @cgseibel - Wired Wednesday?  that sounds amazing with sort of things are you training parents on?
22:04:31 PeggyG -> -EdTechTalk: that's a great point! "I'm so sorry! You have one of the hardest jobs around!" I love that advice!
22:04:45 gay@peopleforeducation.com -> -EdTechTalk: Lorna what we find is that parents are learning so much from one another in our discusssions
22:05:06 cgseibel -> -EdTechTalk: @tanya - connect with @plind - she runs it
22:05:19 gay@peopleforeducation.com -> -EdTechTalk: they are finding out how others approach issues - like eating on the floor for lunch (right ross?)
22:05:53 ross -> -EdTechTalk: yea, that was a good one
22:05:55 cgseibel -> -EdTechTalk: @plind - can you give @tanya your contact info?
22:05:56 Tanya -> -EdTechTalk: thanks Cindy
22:06:06 gay@peopleforeducation.com -> -EdTechTalk: it's like figuring out how to do the simple things as well as the more complex
22:06:13 PeggyG -> -EdTechTalk: yes Gay! I think parents are really validated when they contribute an idea and someone else responds to it--gives them a voice :-)
22:06:25 gay@peopleforeducation.com -> -EdTechTalk: lots of parents have simple questions that they don't know where to get ansers to
22:06:42 gay@peopleforeducation.com -> -EdTechTalk: I agree Peggy
22:06:46 PeggyG -> -EdTechTalk: student-led parent teacher conferences will be a great topic!
22:07:03 ross -> -EdTechTalk: we just started that and it works
22:07:25 PeggyG -> -EdTechTalk: yes you all need to come back!! you have so much to share!
22:07:43 gay@peopleforeducation.com -> -EdTechTalk: thanks everyone! Cindy, I'll check those links
22:08:01 PeggyG -> -EdTechTalk: thanks to all of you for persevering tonight! it was a wonderful conversation!
22:08:09 bsnow_parent -> -EdTechTalk: Thanks!
22:08:10 PeggyG -> -EdTechTalk: good night all!
22:08:18 ross -> -EdTechTalk: thanks, drop us a line when the show is up 
22:08:27 Lorna -> -EdTechTalk: Thanks everyone
22:08:36 cgseibel -> -EdTechTalk: Yes thanks for hanging in there everyone!!
22:08:43 Lorna -> -EdTechTalk: I am sorry we had so emany difficutlies
22:08:48 Lorna -> -EdTechTalk: it was a great show
22:08:58 Lorna -> -EdTechTalk: we hope Ross and Tanya will come back again
22:08:59 gay@peopleforeducation.com -> -EdTechTalk: will do!
22:09:08 Lorna -> -EdTechTalk:  Gay great work on the Ning
22:09:10 PeggyG -> -EdTechTalk: http://www.ourschool.ca/ you can sign up for the RSS feed here and you'll be the first to know when the recording is posted :-)
22:09:11 Tanya -> -EdTechTalk: I would love too!
22:09:20 Lorna -> -EdTechTalk: Anytime we have a show
22:09:31 Lorna -> -EdTechTalk: you have our skype id now you can join in the show
22:09:36 Tanya -> -EdTechTalk: Thanks Lorna, nice chatting with you.
22:09:58 Lorna -> -EdTechTalk: Cindy Peggy thanks for your help
22:10:23 Lorna -> -EdTechTalk: Cindy we have to take your work on the portal to the P4E ning
22:10:46 ross -> -EdTechTalk: merry christmas to all and to all a good night
22:11:07 Lorna -> -EdTechTalk: bsnow_parent cw  monty1 thanks for joining us
22:11:25 Lorna -> -EdTechTalk: have a good night everyone